Binder Management Feedback

It would be easier if there was a way to move where a binder is in the hierarchy using buttons (up, down, left, right).

I work on a small laptop, and doing something like dragging a folder from the bottom of a binder with many folders to the top is not easy to do with a track paid. Even if you have a mouse, you have to find the area at the top of the binder folder which will cause it scroll when hovering over it. This is tricky.

Also, when dragging and dropping, it requires a good amount of precision to differentiate between dragging into a folder and dragging above the folder to place it at the same level in the hierarchy.

I’m aware of the Move option via right-click, but this gets to my second point.

If I right-click a folder and select Add > Folder, my expectation is that it will add the folder as a child of the folder I selected. Instead, it adds it as a sibling (at the same level in the hierarchy). If i right-click on a folder and select Add Text, the text is added as a child of the folder I selected.

If i use the right-click menu to move a folder, it will add the folder moving as a child of the folder i select.

So, the end up is I’m never really sure where a folder is going to wind up when I try to move one or add one, unless I use the drag and drop, which is not easy to use.

I am lazy and didn’t really search much, so if this is already feedback you received, apologies. Love this software. It’s been extremely helpful to me. It is a great tool.

  1. Ctl-cmd left/right arrow promotes/demotes a document in the hierarchy. Ctl-cmd up/down arrow moves it up and down within its current folder. I find these an awful lot more convenient that a button would be, but if you really need them, then click on the icon bar and choose ‘customise’ – you’ll find suitable buttons there.

  2. There is a setting in Preferences > General for ‘Always create new objects as siblings’. Does turning this on (or off) give you more what you are after when you create a new document?

HTH

Thank you! The keyboard command is very helpful. That is awesome.

Regarding option two, it’s actually under Navigation in preferences. Not trying to nitpick, but in case anyone else comes across this. I changed it, but to be honest, I can’t figure out what it does.

It’s not a huge deal, I can always get to what I need to do, but adding folders seems to work differently than what I expect. It’s not hard to just move the folder where I want, especially now that I know there are keyboard commands.

And just to make it clear the thing I find confusing:

folder 1
folder 2

If i wanted to add another folder as a child of folder one, my expectation is that I can right-click folder one and select add folder. The result would be that a folder is added as a sibling of folder 2. The way it works now is that it adds a folder as a sibling of folder 1.

Again, this is just feedback as a new user and it may or may not be useful to you. I don’t necessarily expect you to change anything.

No problem – I don’t work for the company, just another user, but they read all the comments and are very responsive.

Not sure why the setting doesn’t work for folders (it does for files) – I’d never noticed that before. As you say, it’s only a keystroke to change the indent.

Actually, I’ve just looked in the Manual (p507) and it says: “Folders are always created as siblings, even when this option is off”, so the behaviour is intentional.

Or at least documented, which is the difference between a feature and a bug. :slight_smile:

The logic behind creation of children vs siblings is: “…creating a new document or group when the selection is on a Group will always create a child. When the selection is on a Document, it will create a sibling.” Citing DawnV in another post on this forum (https://forum.literatureandlatte.com/t/division-of-document-into-sections/408/3).

Not knowing how it worked was driving me nuts too! :slight_smile:

Actually that logic isn’t quite it. It is in fact:

  • Folders are always created as siblings of whatever is selected, unless what is selected is a special root folder (Draft or Research), in which case the folder is added as a child.
  • When creating a new text document, if a folder is selected, the new document becomes a child; if a document is selected, the new document becomes a sibling.

This logic is based on the following assumptions:

  1. Although you can create root folders (folders on the same level as the Draft etc), this is likely to be needed more rarely than adding folders and files inside the Draft and Research folders. Thus the exception of new folders being created as a child of the Draft and Research folders.

  2. Documents of the same type should be made siblings - so, folders are created as siblings of folders. It would be annoying (for me) if I wanted to set up ten chapter folders, but every time I tried to create a new chapter it was created inside the selected chapter folder.

  3. If a folder is selected and you create a new document, it’s more likely that you want the document added inside the folder than outside it. This assumption is more tenuous, because in reality it’s likely that sometimes you want a new document made as a subdocument and other times as a sibling. However, the software has to make a decision, and it’s best for it to be consistent - if new documents sometimes became siblings of folders and other times children (e.g. depending on whether the folder was expanded or had children or whatever), the user would have to remember more rules and it would seem completely random if you weren’t familiar with those rules.

  4. Most importantly: it’s very easy to move a document after you’ve created it. A quick Ctrl-Opt-Cmd + Left or Right dedents or indents the new document if it didn’t land exactly where you wanted it.

All the best,
Keith

Yes, this. 100% agreed.

It is small usability touches like this that make Scrivener so awesome and comfortable for me. It’s been a learning curve (and there’s more to learn) – but these are the rails that keep us on the track! :slight_smile: