Can someone please walk me through this?

I’m trying to use Scrivener with Bookends and Pages for a research paper. This is a bit of a trial run for my dissertation, and I seem to be making more work for myself, not less. Could someone please help walk me through exactly what I need to do to make these three programs work together?

I’ve done all the business where I set up Bookends as my citation manager in Scrivener. I apologize in advance, because I’m sure at least a few of these are stupid questions, but… well, I’ve been going around in circles with this for a while, and it seems better just to ask.

So here’s my process. I write in Scrivener; when I use a quote or need to cite a source, I drag the citation in from Bookends and do an inline footnote. Repeat a bunch of times; when I’m done I export to Pages for final formatting, and that’s where things get iffy.

When I go to scan the Pages doc to create the citation, all sorts of weird formatting things happen. Most frustrating, though, is that there doesn’t seem to be any way to include page numbers for citations.

Do I need to do individual citations for each quote in Bookends (that is, if I quote from page 39 and page 41 of A. Smith’s book, should be there two citations for that in Bookends)? I don’t mind manually inserting page numbers as I go, but the way I’m doing it now I end up having to go back to insert them after I’m done converting everything to footnotes, and that’s just a huge pain.

I know this is getting a bit outside the boundaries of just Scrivener–in fact, Scrivener is the most well-oiled piece of this particular machine–but it seems like lots of folks on here use a similar workflow, so I’m hoping someone can help a befuddled PhD student. :smiley:

ETA: mods, I have a sneaking suspicion I’ve put this in the wrong area of the forum. Please feel free to move it or let me know where I should repost it.

I haven’t actually tried the Bookends part of this, but I suspect part of the problem is Pages’ inability to deal with footnotes in an RTF file. Unless you are opening the RTF in another word processor first and then saving as a .doc file from there, and importing the .doc file into Pages (whew), then any citations embedded in footnotes will be lost or end up as regular text that merely looks like endnotes (using RTFD).

Have you tried scanning the compiled RTF with Bookends directly, first, and then getting the finished product into Pages somehow?

I don’t really know much about the options in Bookends though, so hopefully someone else can help you with the page numbering deal.

Both Scrivener and Pages work really well with EndNote.
You may be able to get a campus license for Endnote: about $13 a year for a CD copy.

Then again, you may not! My university never offered this sort of deal when they were using Endnote, and they stopped using it altogether a few years ago. But in any case, I’ve just tried a Pages document with a temporary citation of

{Adair, 1973, #222@1 and 2}

in a footnote, and Bookends has no trouble with it. I haven’t tried the whole exporting from Scrivener, because that doesn’t seem to be the problem (if I understand correctly, you seem to have the footnotes with their citations in the Pages document, but not the page numbers with the citations). You don’t say what format (APA, Harvard, etc) you are using. If the problem is only with the page numbers not appearing, it may be because you are doing something wrong in Bookends. It has a lot of options for formatting. I’d try the Bookends forum. Jon is very helpful. And make sure you are using the latest version of Bookends. Sometimes Jon releases “silent updates” which cure some bug that has appeared.

Best of luck with it,
Martin

If, as I think, you are asking if you need two references in Bookends, then no, absolutely not. You just put two citations to the same Bookends reference in the appropriate place in your Scrivener document, using the @ sign to mark the page number, so you have citations like this:

{Smith, 1992, #66104@39} and {Smith, 1992, #66104@41}

You can see that these are the same reference in Bookends because they have the same unique ID (the number after the #).

Then when you scan the document later as an rtf or in Pages, (or Word or Mellel) these will be replaced by citations something like this (these examples are in APA format, but the formatting will differ depending on what format you use): (Smith, 1992, p. 39} and (Smith, 1992, p. 41)