Foot Note and Bibliographic features

hi! This is my first time to get into a forum like this. I’m a college instructor in the Philippines and currently taking my doctoral in Pubic Administration. I was checking out for a good application that would help me in my research papers and eventually my dissertation for my doctoral until i come across CopyWrite and tried its version. I read in its fora about a much better one at a fraction of the cost–scrivener. And so i scrambled to look for it and finally got to download the beta. i’ve been pretty much fascinated by the features and the ease that it possibly can provide to write such voluminous articles and with the kind of disorganized thoughts that i have. But you see, in academic circles, we write research papers and books, quoting other authors and scholars, and thats where all the troubles come in. I know there’s a way of doing footnotes and bibliographic references with the current version, but its not ideal and tidy when you actually get to write while cross-referring materials and jotting down titles and authors, and publishing houses, and dates. I wish there would be a feature that allows for real footnoting that attaches to the page of words or phrases that have been footnoted and correspondingly would have bibliographic pages organized separately as a document. There should also be a smart way of inputing information for the bibliographic page even within the text editor mode of the program. This will really be a real beater to all other programs in the market, and since most academics prefer macs, they would surely switch to Scrivener for their research papers and thesis and dissertations. And most importantly, these should be readily exportable to word process for only minor reformatting and putting other finishing touches. Hope this concern would be given due merit.Thanks. Mabuhay to the developer!

Dear Mark,

I am a user of Scrivener and an academic as well, and while I got into Scrivener mostly for non-academic writing, I do use it for academic work also in various ways (because it is such a great program to work in, I find I want to do more and more stuff in it). So, here are a few thoughts on your wish.

First, it is important to note that the footnote function does make “real footnotes”. When you are working on your Scrivener text, the footnotes will appear right within the paragraphs of your text, but when you export your draft to (for example) Word, these footnotes will become traditionally formatted footnotes of the sort you are familiar with. So, the footnotes are real, they are just not “formatted”–formatting footnotes is a page layout operation.

Second, some people in areas where footnotes are really long lists of citations and such find it disruptive to see the footnotes in the body of their text while they are working. So, that might be a downside, if you are in such an area. I myself have not found this problematic, but it is something you might need to consider.

Third, I am not quite clear what is the special bibliographic page function you are looking for. You can, of course, make a document at the end of your preoject where you place bibliograhphic info. It is hard to see how Scrivener could in any way automate this process–without also becoming a bibliographic database application–which presumably is not going to happen.

But with the combination of Scriv and some bibliographic software, you can go far:

I use Endnote bibliographic software in conjunction with Scrivener and it works fine. The process is like this: When I want to cite a work in my text, I select the relevant item out of my Endnote database, and paste a “temporary citation” into my Scrivener document. Also, at the very end of my Scriv project I have an extra document containing nothing by the heading ‘References’. When I want a formatted version of my paper, I export my draft to Word, and run Endnote on the resulting Word document–this converts all temporary citations to citations in the right citation style I need, and it places all the full references at the end of the document (under the ‘References’ heading). Perhaps this is something like what you were loking for?

Best,
Greg

P.S. There are quite a lot of Scrivener users on this forum who have written (or are writing) their dissertations using Scrivener. So, it clearly can be done and done well!

If you search the forum for “footnote,” “endnote,” “annotation,” and “bibliography” you will discover vast discussions of how to implement these features. Academics are a vociferous lot. :smiley:

The current beta has improved handling of these functions and is very stable. You should download it and try it out.

Dave

I really like the new(ish) Ghost Notes mode. At first I didn’t think it would make much difference but it really makes my footnote-heavy texts a lot more readable.

I can get GHOST notes?! Man, I’ve gotta nab that beta!

Thank you so much GR for that detailed response. Surely I’ll be trying them out. Perhaps, i really just have to use Scriv in my work so i can figure out in detail the many impressive features that I’ve read. And to dafu as well, i check on the other discussions you suggested. Thank you. God bless!

I agree with the usefulness of the ES mode. However it would be very cool to have unobtrusive headings of the various sections texts in the ES mode. Just like in the header window.

I export via MultiMarkdown to Latex to PDF which generates all the headings for me nicely formated. But when I’m editing in fullscreen mode or in ES mode then I get lost where I am.

So +1 for subheadings in ES mode and Fullscreen mode.

This has been discussed before, and I’m afraid this won’t get added to any foreseeable 1.x release because it would involve radically altering the way ES mode works (I know on the surface it may seem that it would not, but “under the hood”, as it were, it would take a lot of recoding). I may well consider it for a possible future 2.0, though.
Thanks and all the best,
Keith

I forgot to say that I love Scrivener!

It is by far the closest any word processor has come to separating content from presentation in a usable manor. Keep up the brilliant work, hope to see even better support for the separation of layout and content, like the headings mentioned above.

(and thx for the quick and clear reply :wink: )

Thank you. :slight_smile:
Best,
Keith

I want to do that, too. How do I join?