iCloud and Obsolescence (Split from Published!...)

Note from KB: This topic has been split from here: https://forum.literatureandlatte.com/t/published-manuscript-submissions-tracker/17379/1

Thanks, but, unfortunately, this is impossible for me. I cannot run Leopard. And - not your fault - but I’m honestly a bit annoyed at Apple for dropping all support for people who have been loyal customers for decades. Lion seems to have broken a lot of things even for people who have nearly-new hardware.

But, again, this doesn’t affect you. Good luck with the software; it looks cool, and I’m sorry I won’t be able to use it.

Lot’s of companies have planned hardware obscolesence, but Apple is the only company that I know of that deliberately uses software coded obscolesence like this to force people to buy new hardware.

You can run Lion on any Intel computer … I bought my first in 2005/2006. It’s running Snow Leopard, only because I didn’t want to upgrade it to Lion as I wanted to replace it for other reasons.

Given that Apple is the only company that has control of both the software and the hardware, it’s the only company that can tie the two together.



It was more their iOS practices that I have direct experience of. Particularly the farce on MobileMe to iCloud requiring iOS-5 and therefore a hardware upgrade.

Seriously? You clearly haven’t been paying attention to why large corporations are not switching to win 7 until now. We have been forced to rewrite many applications due to “deprecated” OS functions or “incompatible” types. The only difference between Apple and Microsoft on this one is that Apple says it up front.

Mr X, I hate to tell you, but you are incorrect. Lion will not run on all intel processors. The 32bit core2 in my MBP will not run Lion. You must use a 64bit processors for Lion. Sorry.

I agree: most large corps are still on XP. My understanding was that it was because:

  1. XP works, that is to say, does everything they need their employees to do
  2. XP has already been tested and understood by their IT department to be compatible with everything else
  3. moving to a different platform is an expense, and an unnecessary one.

The mere fact that I’m using an OS that is 11 years old, and an Office suite that is 9 years old on relatively new hardware would suggest that Microsoft aren’t the issue here.

The fact that a new OS requires new versions of software - well, yeah, obviously. But I have the choice not to upgrade either hardware or software if I like. I can buy a laptop, and some software and just use them for ever. Unless the hardware itself fails, of course. I bought my home laptop while I was still in education. That was about 10 years ago. The battery is dead, so it needs to be plugged into the mains, and it has no wireless, but that doesn’t matter because as I’ve already said it’s pretty deskbound anyway. It still browses the internet, does Office applications and the other things I bought it to do perfectly well.

Apple’s control of all elements of the supply chain that I care about mean that they can do things like say: If you want to continue to use your me.com email address that you have (a) paid for, and (b) given to hundreds of contacts then you must upgrade from MobileMe to iCloud. Only, to do that, you need to update to iOS5. Only to do that you need to buy a new phone. How much is a new phone? More expensive than a reasonably featured windows laptop.

As you can probably tell, this whole iOS5 / iCloud thing really niggles my noggle.

And not yours alone, Pigfender. I’ve been something of a Mac evangelist for years, but the way they are handling the iCloud thing really, really, bugs me. I will be able to upgrade, as I have an iPhone 3GS - but NONE of my computers will be able to take full advantage of it. This includes our 2011 iMac at work, which is running Snow Leopard. I’ve heard lots of horror stories about people who upgrade from Snow Leopard to Lion losing functionality such as DVD burning capabilities. So I have no intention of doing it - especially as that is not my machine, but belongs to the library.

I love Macs for a lot of reasons. One of the reasons I used to love them is backwards compatibility, simplicity, and sturdiness. Unfortunately, the backwards compatibility no longer applies.

And I paid for Mac.com/mobileme for YEARS.

I think you have a right to be resentful of this gouging. That a one-year-old machine can’t use the new software without an upgrade (or several) is absurd.

I will stop hijacking the thread now!

My main problems with iCloud:

  1. In his last keynote, in relation to iCloud, Steve Jobs kept repeating the mantra, “It just works.” This implied that iCloud would be some sort of sorcery that would solve all previous syncing problems. It doesn’t. Just as with Dropbox, your computers still need to be connected to the internet in order to sync and they still need time to sync. This may sound obvious, but it’s not obvious to non-technical users who hear, “It just works,” and see a little diagram showing a magic cloud keeping all of their devices in sync.

  2. Apple said that iCloud would work with Windows (am I imagining this? I am sure this was said at one point). As far as I can see, though, there are no plans of releasing an SDK for Windows programs here - it’s a Mac/iOS-only thing. That’s hardly surprising coming from Apple, but I’m sure this was said somewhere…

  3. What Apple hasn’t made explicit in all of its marketing materials and keynotes is that iCloud is only available to programs sold through the Mac App Store. Programs sold outside of the Mac App Store have no access to iCloud. The justification is presumably that part of that 30-40% commission we pay Apple for MAS sales is to go towards iCloud, whereas Apple receives no contribution from apps sold outside of the app store and so have no incentive to give them access to servers paid for by Apple. This is not unreasonable, but because this is not made explicit, we get a lot of users asking for iCloud support not realising that their version of Scrivener would never be able to use it anyway. There’s also part of me that doesn’t like Mac App Store-only features, as this seems to be pushing things too much towards the MAS.

I hear great things about iCloud support in programs such as iA Writer, but for all the above reasons it’s certainly not the Dropbox killer some hailed it as.

All the best,

Yes, iCloud is supposed to be for Windows too…

A-ha. Yes, and here:


The trouble is that there is no SDK for Windows, so there is no way to have Windows applications support iCloud (just as there is no way for non-MAS apps to support it). I wonder why it’s available on Windows at all, given this? Probably for iTunes and Apple programs only.

EDIT: Actually it looks as though there were plans for a stripped-down Windows API for last year, but it hasn’t shown up, and it wouldn’t have allowed document syncing anyway.

All the best,

It’s another way to differentiate the systems, I guess, and tempt people.

It really works too (the apple marketing, not the candy / puppies thing. I have no knowledge of the whole candy /puppies thing)…

A few days ago, Mrs Pigfender declared that she wants an iPhone 5 and an iPad.
Not an iPhone 4S, an iPhone5. Even though it doesn’t exist yet.
She is aware of this.

Why does she want an iPhone 5 and an iPad?
Which ones? What will you use it for?
“just Apps. I don’t have Apps at the moment and I want the Apps”

Bear in mind that this is a very intelligent and sensible woman who is very careful with money and purchases and doesn’t play computer games or anything like that.
“just Apps. I don’t have Apps at the moment and I want the Apps”

I swear, I died a little inside.

I sympathise with your wife, pigfender. I’m the same. I haven’t got an iPhone or an iPad, but I somehow feel as though I want Apps too. (This is going back a bit, in aspirational app terms, but I particularly want a spirit level. Nobody knows why, not even myself, because I have precisely no need for a spirit level. Doesn’t stop me wanting a pretend one built into a telephone.) And if I ever do succumb, I wouldn’t want to buy an about-to-be-defunct version of the hardware; might as well get the one on the horizon, with all the latest gizmos.

It’s clever marketing, this I-don’t-really-know-what-it-is-and-I-know-I-don’t-need-it-but-I-want-it-anyway-because-everyone-else-thinks-it’s-wonderful malarkey. I was perfectly happy in my iThing-less, app-less world until a recent Saturday trip on the train to London, when it seemed as though everybody over the age of six had not one, not even two, but sometimes as many as three fancy devices arrayed in front of them. I started to feel as though I must be a technophobe with a lot of catching up to do.

While I am not impressed by Apple’s MobileMe to iCloud debacle (and I consider Lion to be a great OS that is almost ready to come out of beta, hence I was more than a little surprised to see Apple recently begin touting Mountain Lion - I view it as marketing code for “Lion with the worst of the bugs fixed”. But I digress…), I don’t see why you need to buy a new phone to keep your MobileMe email. It works with IMAP.

However, if you want to sync calendars and contacts as well, then… :cry:

Apple claims you can set it up, but reports are that it fails left right and center.

I get that a lot.

The question you should ask is “why?”

I didn’t mean it that way!!! :slight_smile:

As I frequently tell my kids, team, and every stranger who hears me mumbling on the street corners, it isn’t what you meant, it’s how folks choose to twist what you say that really matters.

Politics anyone?

Siren, I showed Mrs Pigfender your post, and she is encouraged that “the internet agrees” with her.

She also wants a spirit level app now.

What sane person wouldn’t want a spirit level app? :smiley: