Note Blizzard

I’m inclined to disagree here. :slight_smile: I think Tinderbox is great for taking notes, even in a quick and dirty fashion—just don’t get caught up in all of what Tb can do, and instead take what it can do to prepare for yourself a place which does not require an excessive amount of fiddling—this is possible.

The most basic thing you can do is to designate an entire Tb file for quick notes. The nice thing about this option is that it can grow with you as you learn more about the interface. It can start out as a simple flat list of notes, and eventually become something more complex if it needs to (and it might never). Further advantages are that Tb notes drag easily from file to file. This file is a great candidate for hooking up Simplenote, as that gives you access to both Notational Velocity (which is by far the most efficient note taker in my opinion) and Simplenote’s inherent mobility if you use mobile devices to take notes. Before Simplenote came along, I would hook this file up to a dedicate e-mail address. I could then send myself notes to this e-mail address all day, and the next time I was around a computer the file would intake the new notes and clean up the mailbox.

The second thing you can do is create an inbox in your existing documents. I use this method for quite a few of mine. This simple mechanism alleviates the “now where do I put this” problem that you face when creating a new note. You don’t have to think about that yet because there is only one place to put it, Inbox. Of course, if you know where it needs to go then that is another matter, you might as well put it directly where it belongs if that spot is easily accessible. An inbox container can be quite useful as it is easy to set it up so that all new notes created within it have a specific prototype.

The next thing to do is visit the Text tab in the document preferences ([b]Cmd-8[/b]). I think it’s important to set this up in a way which reduces effort and makes things as aesthetically pleasing as possible. For example, the simple setting for initial window size can mean the difference between having to constantly change the size of notes as you run out of space (or shrink it to make it more space efficient, if your notes tend toward the short).

At a minimum, all you need to do to jot down an idea is select the Inbox container and press Shift-Enter to make a new note; give it a name (even a temporary name), and then hit spacebar to start typing. I like to take it a step further and always have an “Inbox map” open on my screen. The advantage here is that you utilise spatial relationships without giving it much thought. Put down a few Adornments, like “To Do” and “Ideas”, and when you think of something you need to do, just double click in the Adornment area to make a new note. If categories are not important, you can use the spatial map to assign “rough importance” to things. Maybe stuff along the bottom of the map is less urgent, while stuff along the top is very urgent, with a soft gradient in between. No need to worry about picking a Priority drop-down like in many programs, you can be sloppy about it; easily move things around if they change; and most importantly because it isn’t a static scale, the positioning becomes relative. Meanwhile, stuff along the right side of the map could be time based while stuff on the left has no hard deadline.

The map is one of the unique things about Tinderbox. There are many programs, even note based and information management programs, that have diagramme formats, but very few can take what you intuitively design, and turn it into a functional apparatus. Tinderbox doesn’t always need to do that; one could do quite well just using a fuzzy map as described above, but it can do more, if you need it. Later on, you can build automation if you require it, to take stuff found within adornments and move them to a more appropriate location, or have the appearance of notes change depending upon where they are on your Inbox map. You could create a “Items Due” agent that scans this map and sorts by $Xpos. Perhaps anything not on the left side could get a clock badge and acquire a DueDate attribute in the KeyAttributes, which will make it easy to edit by just opening the note. But all of that can be saved for later.

Hopefully these simple examples elaborate how Tinderbox can be an excellent fuzzy note taking device because it can evolve to work the way you work best and it can be designed to display and even function in accordance with the types of information that are important to you.

One of the nice things about Tinderbox’s learning curve and complexity is that it needn’t be implemented immediately to be beneficial. It’s most often advantageous, in fact, to let a document gradually grow into itself, starting out as little more than a basic outliner. Let its features serve that outline as it becomes useful to automate, rather than trying to anticipate what might be useful and waste your time. It’s quite simple to change your mind later and affect radical changes in the structure and automation if necessary. You don’t have to learn all of its agent syntax at once. If you think of something you’d like to do, you can look it up and implement just that piece and be done with it.

That’s a tremendous description of note-taking in Tinderbox, AmberV! Nicely put.

This has been a remarkable discussion! Sorry I’m late joining in, but I’ve learned a lot already!

Mark Bernstein
Twig and Tinderbox: eastgate.com/Tinderbox

Thanks, Mark! I have to give you credit for the X/Y fuzzy note assignment idea though, as that one is in your book as an example on categorising digital cameras while researching them. :slight_smile:

After following this topic I am willing to try Tinderbox again, since I do love it’s different views and the linking between different topics using different linking styles; which I miss most in DevonThink.
Better, for a couple of seconds even I did understand the workflow you are describing, Ioa. I jot down my notes in NV, which is synchronizing with Simplenote. Thats fine by me, but how do I get all that stuff back into Tinderbox? And is it possible to try that with the demo (thats just me being lazy, I know)?

Yeah, in the document settings (Cmd-8) you need to set up Simplenote synching in the appropriate tab. This will create a container with all of your notes on the server. It’s pretty aggressive about saving and refreshing changes that have been made, so pretty much everything you do should be instantly available everywhere else. The one issue where it might conflict with the demo itself is that if I remember right, the demo only allows the creation of a handful of notes. You can open files with more notes than that, but then can’t create new notes once you exceed the demo limitations, so I’m not sure how that would work with Simplenote, if the notes its generates are considered within the demo limitations or not. You could try with a test account that only has ten notes or so on it, to get a feel for how things would work across the board.

Thanks, this works. Didn’t find anything in the manual, though, but I think ranting about that in this forum would be rather pointless, wouldn’t it?
In an ideal world, I would have something like DevonThink for keeping all the stuff neatly sorted while doing research and something like Tinderbox for organizing them and something which in turns concentrates on the relation between notes (whatever they might contain). A note alone is useless, until I somehow get it into a relation to other notes and vice versa. Does somebody remember WordPerfect InfoCentral? That was, as far as I remember, focusing exactly on the relationship between its nodes.
For example, lets say you have a character “Alfred” which is the father of character “Mary” - so it has been possible to create a relationship “father” from Mary to Alfred and in turn a relationship “child” from Alfred to Mary. Later one might create “Chris” and the relation “brother/sister” to Mary; automatically a relationship “father” to Alfred, and of course “child” from Alfred to Chris. You could of course change all that, especially if you were into writing ancient greek family stories. However, it’s focus was entirely on these connections. Learning to use it was maybe not the easiest thing to do, but is was well worth it. And it lacked any decent UI and Internet-awareness, but it was 1994, so there you were. If just there was a way to combine those three - Devonthink, Tinderbox and the relationship-model of Infocentral, it might either become the most geekiest piece of software ever or the ultimate software. Period.

I’ve found that aTbref5 is the best guide for many TB details, especially those like the Simplenote sync that are relatively recent improvements. This should take you to the Simplenote section.

H

Thanks for explaining SlipBox. Until I saw this thread, I had kind of forgotten about it and had no idea there was a mobile version. My present setup is SimpleNote on the iPad with JustNotes on the Mac (I don’t like Notational Velocity), but seeing that you’re going to have support for SimpleNote I’m now considering a switch (nice mobile interface, by the way; though you should mention in the help where to configure DropBox sync). The other thing I would request for the desktop version is a plugin for Sente: Sente’s new iPad app with its wonderful annotation and notetaking features (basically reproducing everything you can do on the Mac version) has converted me, so it would be great to be able to do everything with Sente that can be done with Bookends and BibDesk.

I’m really looking forward to seeing how SlipBox develops, including of course the Scrivener integration.

Thought I’d post a brief follow up on the discussion about note taking. It turned out that AmberV was right (not very surprising, actually): Tinderbox is a very cool way of taking notes - once you’ve learned how to master the program.

It took several attempts before I got a TB database going that worked for me (I finally figured it out on a very long and tedious plane ride) - but now I have a note gathering system that allows me to write notes on my phone and iPad, automatically import them and allow me to view them in different ways. I regularly change the behavior of my note and add new features that fits my work. So, here’s a rather late thank you to you, AmberV!

There are drawbacks. You basically have to program TB to make it do what you want. That will probably not be to everybody’'s liking. And the program is a quirky.

Cheers
Erik

You’re welcome! Nice to hear you got something working for you.

That’s good to hear, Erik. It would be even better to hear a few details about what you did, such as any tricks that made a difference.

Rick

The last comment was 3 years ago - what’s the current thinking?

About what, precisely? If it’s about the best system and philosophy for keeping notes, I guess the answer is multifold:

  • one major change that has occurred since the original post in this thread in 2010 is that notes apps seem to have proliferated - perhaps partly because they’ve been regarded as suitable for tablets. Less a blizzard, more an avalanche;

  • since 2010, I think the other dominant theme of developmental effort in this area has been syncing - between Mac and iOS notes apps at a minimum, and those apps and Android and Windows equivalents for some. Here the 1,000 lb gorilla remains Evernote, which can sync extensively, but certain of whose other attributes, such as the design and functionality of its apps, appear to some customers to leave quite a lot to be desired;

  • there are also apps which lean on Evernote for syncing but are distinct from it, such as Metanota;

  • at the other end of the scale, the “neat and nimble” niche is filled by Simplenote and notes applications which sync using it, such as nvAlt (sometimes using Markdown for efficient note-taking);

  • in between those extremes are applications which use other means of syncing, for example via iCloud or Dropbox. Those apps include Notebooks and Notesuite. Sometimes, as in those two cases, they combine notes with task management - it has to be said, not always hitting the spot quite as well as dedicated applications in the task-management area;

  • even Microsoft has entered the market recently, with a Mac version of OneNote - a very pale shadow of the Windows version, in my view;

  • unrivalled in what it does, above the crowd but also still undeniably quirky, Tinderbox (now on Version 6, still on the Mac only) continues to reign supreme in its own niche.

I know I’ve omitted many popular and capable applications from the above list, such as Notesy and Justnotes; others may also have their favourites. Generally speaking in my view there’s no single “best” notes app; as with other types of application, it very much depends on what functionality you’re seeking.

Ahh. Tinderbox.

Being OS challenged in that I’m using Windows, I visit the site regularly and lust after what it could do for me (yes I have priced out a Mac but migrating all the software – not just Scrivener and Scapple and Aeon – makes it cost prohibitive).

I go from there to searches for anything on Windows that might fit the bill (OneNote isn’t an option for me – it’s a Microsoft-Phobia thing). ConnectedText looks to have possibilities but I’d be interested to hear from anyone else in the Windows world who has solved this problem.

Thanks,

Richard.

Another place to look - if you haven’t already - is this forum: http://www.outlinersoftware.com.

If you run a search or two, you’ll find that ConnectedText ranks highly in the esteem of Windows users there (although to be completely fair, there appears to be no real Windows equivalent of Tinderbox). Yet another possibility is http://welcometosherwood.wordpress.com, the blogger of which uses a Mac at home and Windows at work (and is also a Scrivener and Tinderbox user).