Si ça te va, tant mieux.
Ça pourrait cependant te causer des ennuis à long terme. Surtout si tu utilisais déjà des sauts de ligne ailleurs dans ton projet, dans d’autres contextes, ce qui t’empêcherait de plus tard utiliser les fonctions automatiques pour les remplacer par des retours/nouveaux paragraphes.
Au delà de l’alinéa qui ne se fera plus, il y a que Scrivener va considérer le tout comme n’étant qu’un seul paragraphe (c’est ce que c’est, quand on met un saut de ligne). Dépendamment de la mise en page que tu souhaiteras pour ton rendu final, ça peut (ou pas) causer problème.
Si tu n’utilisais pas de sauts de ligne (shift + retour) avant maintenant, alors là, aucun problème.
(Je suppose que tu ne vas pas en mettre partout à la place des “retour/enter/return”, mais bien que là où ça t’est nécéssaire, pour tes dialogues.) Venu le temps de faire le compile de ton livre ou autre, puisqu’il n’y aura que ceux-là, il te sera simple de faire en sorte qu’ils soient automatiquement remplacés par de véritables paragraphes, ce qui te rendra le contrôle de ta mise en page.
Quoiqu’il en soit, dans le cas où les sauts de ligne te serviraient déjà ailleurs dans d’autres contextes, je pense que l’idéal serait vraiment de passer par l’autre option dont je t’ai parlé. Soit de jouer un tour au logiciel, pour le dire ainsi.
Tu n’as, si c’est le cas et besoin est, qu’à me le laisser savoir, ça me fera plaisir de t’aider.
I could not follow the complete discussion as it was very often in French, but the Dialogue focus assumes that the quotes are opened/closed within the same paragraph, which is the most common case. If the closing quote is missing within the paragraph, we assume that someone has forgotten to place it.
We have had cases where users intentionally misplace open/closing quotes. We cannot handle all user cases in the Dialogue Focus tool, so we handle the most common ones.
I understand.
Although I would rather consider this to be the most common usage/form nowadays:
“Hello!
– Hi.
– What’s up?”
There is also, as I pointed out earlier, the fact that should the Dialog Focus wait until it met a closing quotation mark to fade the text, it would make it a great tool to confirm one didn’t forget a closing quote mark here or there, which is often a tad stressful for a writer that is still today using them.
Although I am aware that it wouldn’t/couldn’t ever satisfy everyone, nor be fail proof, as it couldn’t do much for a writer in the case of mistakes such as this one:
"Hello my friend, said William. “What’s up?” (Minimalistic example. One could argue that in this case it is the second opening quote mark that doesn’t belong, but I think you’ll get my point.)
(Not really a big miss though, as yes, most third party correctors handle mistakes like this anyways.)
As a solution to the current issue, I proposed to my fellow user to have Scrivener auto-replace — with "— , and then auto-replace "— with — (so the other way around) at compile.
Or to use line-breaks instead of carriage returns in the dialogs (but that is conditional to not using line-breaks anywhere else) and then have them replaced with carriage returns at compile, so that paragraphs are restored, and that he/she’d then regain control over the formatting.
There you go. I think that covers pretty much what was discussed in French.
Unless I am awfully mistaken, in a dialog where replies are indicated by –
each reply is a new paragraph, with its first line indent.
Using line-breaks doesn’t allow the indent, nor the paragraph’s space before/after. (Space before/after is the proper way to format a paragraph, not enter-enter.)
Line-breaks you’d normally use in a list, or in poetry; for e.g.
Since that time… no news ! nothing has been done for the french community to use this key function that is the dialog focus ! Yet it had been asked numerous time to take account of the – to be part as dialog markers !
won’t we have the chance to use the full potential of Scrivener ??
Ça fonctionne, en français. Mais juste pas si tu as des répliques en tiret cadratin (qui en soi sont un nouveau paragraphe).
Donc, autrement dit, ça ne fonctionne que si le guillemet fermant est à l’intérieur du même paragraphe que son guillemet ouvrant. La fonction ne le cherche pas (le fermant) dans les paragraphes suivants, et ne déborde donc pas du premier paragraphe.
Les anglophones n’ont pas moins le même problème.
. . . . . . . . .
It works, in French. Just not if you have replies that start with "— " (and that therefor are a new paragraph on their own).
It doesn’t look for the closing quote mark further than, and limits itself to the very first paragraph — to the one where it stumbled upon the opening quote mark. It doesn’t go beyond.
English writing people have the same issue.
This said, yes, it’d be nice if it could be improved.
Thanks but I use – like a lot of french writers, thus it’s not working for me
the dialog focus has the avantage to exist why not coding it too so that everybody can use it ? – for opening the quote and the breaking line to close it.
it’s not that much of a hassle to add that part in the code of the dialog focus.
(not to sound too much commanding… but I already suggest it a looooooong time ago and I am not the only one, but since then, nothing)
As I said, it doesn’t work for English writers either. (Le tiret cadratin comme ouverture de réplique n’a rien d’exclusif au français.)
All the more reasons to fix it.
Du coup on fait quoi ? ^^ on crée un nouveau topic dessus et on insiste jusqu’à avoir une réponse ou une prise en compte ? j’avoue que j’ai demandé plusieurs fois gentiment… si le sujet rassemble assez de monde peut-être que ça fera bouger un peu ?? je dis ça mais bon… ça m’attriste de pouvoir dialoguer avec un SAV réactif mais qui ne va pas plus loin que le “ok, on en parle au développeur mais de toutes façons on n’aura aucune news ou retours à ce sujet”…
Il n’y a à peu près que moi dans la thread.
Alors si c’est à moi que tu fais référence par “SAV” : détrompe-toi. Je ne suis pas le service après vente, mais seulement qu’un user comme toi.
non non rassure toi, j’étais en contact avec Ruth du Support Staff pour Windows. Beaucoup d’échanges de mail pour 0 résultat au final… je ne sais pas si c’est un problème de communication, ou bien d’organisation… ça fait un moment que cette demande existe pourtant et comparé à certaines corrections de bug vu dans les updates, celle-là semble pourtant méga nécessaire ! bref ^^
@tiho_d@Tiho
hi !
Since you seem to be the developper for the Windows version, can you give us an answer for this lack with the – with the dialog focus please ?
I had some discussion about it last year with Ruth from the Support team for Windows but we have no news and I assume it’s a big bug when proofreading your manuscript, because, let’s face it, a lot of people use – for dialog.
Can you please give us some info about it pleeeeease
Remember that this function was programmed with little effort on macOS, but had to be painstakingly programmed for the Windows version. That’s also why there are no more options than Direct Speech.
If you really want, you could create a Regular Expression to replace the style you want with Quotes to make Dialogue Focus work and then revert it back to the style you want.
Thx I appreciate the answer, but I would prefer the program I bought to be functional ^^
I understand there is a lot of work for programers since the windows developper is working on Scapple too. But as I told Ruth (from the support team), we asked it a long lonnnnnng time ago.
Thus, it would be honest to know if this function will one day or not be coded.
I am not asking to be done NOW… but since we waited so long for this tool on windows maybe we just could have an answer in order to know if we keep waiting… or not
We don’t remove things from the list unless the conditions necessitating it change (like if everyone in the world that uses this punctuation format stops using it all of the sudden). If the status of something changes in a notable way we will update threads with that, perhaps to get new information. Otherwise when you see it show up in the change logs is the main status check.
Our internal list of things to fix or add to the software. All of this above (and more) is stuff we have detailed plans for, it just hasn’t been done yet.
@AmberV thx !
that was my latest question : if it was on the to-do-list or not ?
thus with your answer I understand it’s not a lost cause but a futur project
I feel relieved and I hope too see it soon (but no pressure )
)