Is Windows Scrivener worth the jump from Mac?

Scrivener
1

Bit of an explanation leading to the question: I’ve used Scrivener on macOS since version 1.0. I’m currently using a 2012 MacBook Pro as my primary writing device. It works well enough, but I’m going to lose OS upgrade support relatively soon, and its battery is not what it used to be. I tried using Scrivener on my iPad (on which I do damn near everything else), but found the lack of multitasking frustrating. I’ve come to realize that Scrivener is one of the sole reasons why I continue to use macOS at all, and this leads me to a question: Do I save up enough money to buy a new Mac (~$1500 for a new Air, for instance) of which I already have all of the purchased software, or do I buy a less expensive windows laptop and a new Windows license of Scrivener?

The TL;DR of this is this: what are your experiences with Scrivener for Windows? How does it compare against the macOS version? Is it identical, feature for feature? Is it more or less stable than the macOS version?

2

$1,500? I’ve been using the base model of the new Air for a year now. It’s ideal for Scrivener. I’m not in the US, but I see there are deals for the base model at $800, at the moment. I went the MBA route after considering an iPad for writing. Zero regrets. And I really like the machine itself. Windows? Blurgh!

3

If you’re really going to ditch the Mac, wait until version three is officially out for Windows, and in the mean-time, follow the Windows beta forums to see how it’s shaking out. Do keep in mind that Scrivener doesn’t currently support the touch interface well, so don’t go into a purchase hoping to use Scrivener that way.

I’ve got the beta installed on my work machine, and it’s looking pretty good these days, so it may be the way to go for people with your needs.

4

One possible approach to keep your MacBook running is to have its battery replaced. Here’s an official Apple table of battery replacement prices in the US:

MacBook Pro Out of Warranty
16-inch MacBook Pro $199
15-inch MacBook Pro with Retina display $199
13-inch MacBook Pro with Retina display $199
15-inch MacBook Pro $129
13-inch MacBook Pro $129
17-inch MacBook Pro (Vintage) $179

I’m sure less costly replacement service can be found from third party shops.

Not going to try to otherwise influence your choice of OS. Historically, cost of ownership is more upfront for Mac, more continuous for PCs. I’ve had my MBA 11 since 2015 and in the meantime my son has worn through three reasonably upscale Dell PCs, for a greater total cost. YMMV.

Happy hunting!

5

I’ll bite…

[size=120]No[/size]

  1. There is a question of “do you want to spend time learning to use something new or spend your time writing?” You already know the OSX stuff. The Windows version will never be "identical’ just based on the UI and file management of WINDOWS.

  2. I use windows all day at work (as I’m sure many OSX people do) and I actually like keeping the “work computer” different from the “not work” as it helps me set my mental processes into the right mode for what I’m going to do. I don’t want to be looking at a blank screen and only have thoughts about work.

  3. The cost argument is bit … specious … but my experience is that OSX ecosystem is overall less costly than windows over a standard 10yr lifespan of the apple hardware.

6

For totally different reasons, I’m currently in the process of turning in my 2015 13” MBP as part of an exchange for a 2015 27” 5K, heavily loaded iMac. So, I’ve also taken the opportunity of “Black Friday” to acquire a 2TB SSID and 16GB RAM to install in my 17” MBP. It won’t upgrade beyond MacOS 13, but will do everything I want for the foreseeable future, including video editing with Final Cut Pro, which is a glutton for disk space.

Mark

7

I hope it’s good reasons.

8

Other thoughts while waiting or not – if you have the Mid 2012 (if not, ignore my post till the last paragraph), Apple says you can run 10.15 on it. I’d go with 10.14, for now.
support.apple.com/kb/sp803

If you’re a tinkerer, you can replace/upgrade the battery, RAM and HDD yourself, or have someone do it for you. Regardless, keep in mind that that machine has value because of that replace/upgrade ability:
eshop.macsales.com/installvideo … id12_batt/

If you decide to purchase a MBA, if you prefer the older model because of the ports and keyboard, the 2017 edition does show up at the Apple refurb store.

9

One thing I don’t often see mentioned in the Mac or Windows (or Linux) debate is that by default macOS and Macs are simply better suited to writers/programmers in one specific sense, at least.

I’m not talking about the software, or the hardware, but the way an OS combines with hardware to make inputting endless acres of text more or less easy.

In this regard, macOS is simply better designed than the alternatives. E.g. the basic of text navigation and shortcuts: having the main modifier on the control key is more uncomfortable than the cmd key on the thumb. E.g. for something as common as forward/back word, which is used hundreds of times a day, that inconvenience soon builds up. (This isn’t a question of familiarity - of course you can get used to it, but of the unnecessary friction and bad design of having the most used modifier in the least convenient spot).

Of course you can (and should) correct this by modifying the layout on both platforms so that Ctl is on Caps Lock and therefore easier to reach. Still not as good as having it on a thumb key, but better than the stupid default position, at least. But… On the Mac this is a setting in System Preferences; in Windows you have to change an obscure Registry Setting, or install additional software like Autohotkeys. Windows is just more faff to get a decent setup. It’s additional faff to go through to correct a bad default design.

Then you have the issue of typing common accents and symbols. MacOS gives you two easy, logical, discoverable (through the keyboard viewer) methods of using accents (dead keys or long presses). Windows has to use 2014+Alt+x (or Alt+0151 on the number pad) for an em-dash. Is it still 1990? So you end up having to use something like Autohotkeys again just to get what should be provided by default as a simple shortcut.

The Mac also has some implementation of Emacs keys (ctl-a/b/d/e/f/n/p/t and you can add more) which are very useful and lacking on Windows.

The one thing Windows does better than MacOS is the Alt+Letter system for navigating menus… and the Mac could be improved (I use Karabiner Elements to do things like: tap caps lock for Escape, hold it for Ctl; and tap Return for Enter, hold it for Ctl), but by default, there is no question which system is better set up for the act of getting words onto the screen, as a matter of usability (rather than as what you’re used to).

For me. Of course, none of this may matter if you use the mouse/trackpad a lot (I avoid it as much as possible) and arrow keys rather than shortcuts, but otherwise, I think that there is noticeable extra friction involved in using Windows over Macs if you’re a heavy keyboard user.

This rant (and it’s not wholly serious…) has been brought to you by the intense irritation caused in using Windows 10 over the last six months on a used Thinkpad I bought to try to stop myself buying a new MacBook and finding that simple things are just harder than they should be…

10

I believe that you are seriously underestimating the amount of conditioning involved in your responses. I’ve been primarily a DOS and Windows user since my first PC-compatible in 1990 and find the alternative keybindings for Mac and Linux and especially eMacs annoying as all get out. I’ve been happily a key-heavy user in Windows all of this time, but no more so than when I was running Vista SP1 on my MBP via Boot Camp because the keyboard experience was just so wonky to my trained reflexes.

11

I did say it was partly tongue in cheek… :wink:

I think the points about accents/symbols stand on their own – Windows’ system is archaic and should have been reworked years ago.

For the others, obviously, familiarity breed contentment, whichever you use. But we’re talking about the design, not the fact that one gets used to anything and swapping is a pain. I used Dos/Windows for twenty years before getting a Mac (and have used Linux for long periods since alongside the Mac) and was happy enough.

But are you really saying that having the most common modifier for the OS tucked away in the left hand little finger position can be as ergonomic as having it on the thumb by the space bar? That’s a movement down and left of least an inch each time, compared to half an inch sideways for the thumb… I can’t see how that’s right – not as a matter of familiarity, but of design, and it’s something that someone moving from the Mac to Windows may find irritating at best.

12

No disagreement from me on that one!

I’m not a specialist in ergonomics, but I do know that when I was having to deal with potential carpal tunnel surgery, one of the things I did talk about with the experts is that a lot of good ergonomics (at least, what they understood then) is often counter-intuitive. Like, it’s not necessarily the distance you travel for the keypress so much as the angle when referenced to the joint. Within two months of giving up my “ergonomic” keyboard and switch to a Unicomp design that basically was the old IBM Model-M/Focus 2000 buckling keyswitch design, my carpal tunnel symptoms had disappeared – because the need for a little extra force on the keys forced me to raise my wrists the way I’d been taught when I learned how to touch type.

The only time I had trouble with using keys with my little finger was when I was first learning to touch type. After I got used to it, it was fine. I literally don’t think about it at all. So I’m not trying to assert that you’re wrong, so much as I am saying that perhaps a lot more of this stuff we try to justify using seemingly objective metrics is really just more personal preference than we really understand or admit.

I’m a huge believer in customization, though, and I will agree that current Mac OS seems to strip away some of the navel-gazing types of customization and focus on some of the more useful ones. More of my friends who have joint and mobility issues tended to be more comfortable on Macs (albeit with third-party keyboards and pointing devices) for this reason, historically, but these days I think it’s a toss-up between any of the major operating systems.

13

The little finger down to the control key is bad is many ways, though, including both travel and the scrunching up – couldn’t be in a worse position. Without checking, I wonder if it’s because Dos/Windows was designed when the old keyboard config (Control where Caps Lock is on modern keyboards) was still in force? That would make sense, I suppose. I know some people use the edge of their fist to hit it, but that only works with keyboards where the FN key is to the right of the control key (which you can now change on the Mac… you didn’t use to be able to.) Others use their thumb – either way, it’s not good for a home key user…

On the desktop I use the Kinesis Advantage, so all the modifiers are on thumbs anyway, and Windows is easier in that regard (though it’s an iMac, so I’m only using Windows through Parallels). Otherwise, I use Emacs, so having all those weird modifier combinations makes thinking about this sort of thing a necessary defence mechanism! I still think the Mac is better designed from scratch though as a system working together for this purpose, if you take the familiarity out of it…

14

It is :laughing:

Mr X

15

Excellent news Mr X, excellent news.

16

Just getting there Jaysen. The 5K iMac I’m getting has 24GB of RAM and most importantly 2GB VRAM. Unfortunately, I can’t afford a new 16" MBP, and 2GB VRAM is the minimum for a new app I need to run.

But the other problem is that most of our external storage drives are FireWire drives. The 17" has a FireWire 800 port as well as a Thunderbolt port, for which I have a USB 3 adapter, plus three other USB 2 ports. The 27" doesn’t have a FireWire port. Apart from that, the 17" also has a terrific screen.

At least I won’t have to lug it around to the extent that I used to. :slight_smile:

Mr X

17

Jan 1 I’ll be ordering 16” MBP i9, 32gb RAM 8gb VRAM and 2tb SSD.

Plenty of grunt for video and running a VM.

Impatiently waiting for the NY to roll over.

18

Lucky you! Being a pensioner, I don’t have that kind of moolah! :smiley:

Mark

19

That’s why I’m still working 50+ hours at 68. So I can buy the last few items I want before I retire. :smiley:

20

Being retired just gives you more time to look at new laptops…