Pulling for the "Bad Guy"

Ok usually the good guy wins, gets the girl, vanquishes the bad guy and a celebration is in order.

But have you ever read a book where you came to like the bad guy more than the good guy and you were secretly pulling for the bad guy and felt a tad disapointment when he lost?

I did when I read Timothy Zahn’s Star Wars trilogy with the introduction of Admiral Thrawn.

I loved this character. I love his intelligence, his sense of duty, and his compassion.

So is there any “bad” character out there you have read about that you ending up thinking as one of your favorite characters?

If so why?

Hmm, is it fair when all of the characters are tremendously foul and monstrous cases of broken humanity? Then again, when reading anything by Brian Evenson, it’s more like “cringing for the main character” (if there is one) more than rooting for anyone. You just want the nightmare to end, but you can’t stop reading the horror!

All the time. Sark, in Alias. Adam in Heroes (I hated Season 3 - and it’s spiralling downhill began with Adam’s death and the absolutely rubbish Arthur Petrelli’s introduction).* Sylar in Heroes, Season 2, too, where he was riding with the twins. How I spent every episode just wishing he’d kill them already. Wile E. Coyote. God I hated that Road Runner. Bloody ACME. How I longed to see the coyote sing his fangs into that irritating feathery neck and end the beep-beeping forever.

Hmm, this isn’t really as high-browed as I’d hoped my response was going to be…

Oh, wait - Battlestar Galactica: Baltar. He’s probably my favourite character. His only real flaw is that he is a coward, and along the way he has been treated abominably. He saved Callie’s life - she blackmailed him in return. He saved Roslin’s life - she tried to cheat the elections and wanted him dead in return. The writers of BSG are too smart to have any real good guys or bad guys, but Baltar was a villain of the original series and I’m never sure whether we are genuinely supposed to side with Admiral Adama and the loathsome Roslin or not. I know I always find myself shouting “BUT HE’S RIGHT!!!” at the screen whenever they look at him with hatred for his explanations, and throw him in jail, off the ship or whatever…

I also liked Stringer Bell in The Wire and didn’t want to seem him die. And Bodie. Not that anyone other than Marlo’s crew could really be described as true bad guys in the Wire, but these guys came close… (Well, maybe not Bodie - he was just a soldier and Poot had to push him into killing Wallace.)

  • I just remembered that Sark in Alias and Adam in Heroes are played by the same character.

I actually have a soft spot for Vic-k


Guy != dog
Guy != cat
Guy != skeletal remains
Guy != Psychotic psychiatrist


How do you know he is a guy and not a dog with an uncanny grasp of communication with a keyboard?

Two reasons. First, no dog could possibly punctuate a sentence in Vic-k’s nine/seven time signature. Second, dogs simply aren’t allowed in The Red Lion, not even under the table!

They got pills for that now…

I, will, rise above this!
9/7? :open_mouth: cheek!

With them little legs you don’t have much room to rise.


The hero of “The Scottish Play”? Duncan, Macduff? So bland!

And wouldn’t the pre-qel trilogy have been so much better if we really had been able to root for Darth?


Ahh, dear Darth. One of my earliest role models.
Faites attention,
Le`D :smiling_imp:

Jango Fett. And (God help me!) Richard Armitage as Guy of Gisborne. :open_mouth: I think it can happen when the “bad guy” character is better written than the “good guys,” or when the actor portraying the “baddie” does such a great job that he steals the show.

Swoon! :slight_smile: If ever a Guy should have got the girl, it was him. Baddies rock!

Mr Blount!

First you tell me Zaff dies in Spooks two years before it was broadcast in Australia, and now you have done it with Heroes as well!

Ah… I was about to say how good Richard Armitage is as Lucas North, Adam’s replacement in series 7 of Spooks - so I guess you don’t want to know what happens to Adam, then? :blush: (Actually, it’s probably best not to get too attached to any of the characters in Spooks.)

Anyway, you could look at it like this: at least you know that when Adam in Heroes meets his (completely rubbish) end, then it’s time to turn off. The rest of the series is pants (even though the first half of S3 is brilliant). An even better character meets an (see, I didn’t say “his” or “her”) end a couple of episodes later… And it’s still not as cruel as what David did to me many years ago when I was reading 1984: he took the book from me and read the very last sentence, “Winston Smith loved Big Brother.” B*****d. (Now you’re going to tell me that you have just started reading 1984, aren’t you?)

Adam goes, too?!?

To be honest, I didn’t like Adam that much anyway, although he slowly grew on me. The good thing about Spooks is if they introduce a new character you don’t like (that blonde chick in series 5 and 6), you know they won’t be around for long. But, why oh why did they cut Jo’s hair? I have disliked her ever since that.

Spooks i shown so haphazardly here that I just wait for the DVD to come out and watch it all at once. We just got Series 6 towards the end of last year, so it will probably be at least a year before we see Series 7.

By the way, what is the spin-off series like? We are yet to get that here either, but I saw it was out on DVD when I was over in Cambridge.

Oh, and I read 1984 when I was 14. Would probably help to read it again now, I might understand it better.

The spin off series, Spooks: Code 9, is s**t. Really, really bad. It’s basically aimed at teenagers (which is why it was shown on BBC3 here). It has nothing to do with the regular series - they just used the brand, that was all. It’s set in the future, after a bomb has wiped out London and so MI5 set up in Manchester or somewhere, and have to recruit all new officers, who are all about twelve (well, they are all around 18-20). To be honest I only watched the first episode, but if you like the intelligence of the regular series then don’t bother with Code 9.

I won’t say anything about Adam… It’s no secret that the actor has left the series, though. Tom got written out well, by going mad. I never warmed to Adam as much as to Tom, but I did like Tom. The new character, Lucas North, I liked immediately. Jo is a good character, but a bit underused. By the “blonde chick”, do you mean Ros, acted by Herione Norris? The one who has an affair with Adam? I didn’t like her for ages, either. But with Adam out of the picture she comes into her own in Series 7 and I started to really like the character. (Series 7 was much more like the earlier series in spirit, with more standalone episodes.)

Talking of Jo… The actress is in a new Sitcom, called Plus One. There was a pilot for it starring Rory Kinnear last year which was hilarious. And then series got commissioned, Kinnear is no longer part of it and some other actor takes his place, and it is pretty dire… A shame as it had such promise. Not that you’ll get to see that in Australia for a while, I guess.

Hmm, I think we have meandered wildly off-topic. Oh well. To sort of get back on track - I did like the bad girl in Spooks series 6. The Iranian (?) girl who tried to kill Adam. I wanted her to get away with it (except not with killing Adam) - I really wanted to see her kick Ros’s ass rather than the other way around. Oh well.

THAT IS VIC-K’S JOB!!! Now what will he do?

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