I’ve been using Time Machine to back up all my work. Occasionally, I’ve turned to it to restore some file or piece of work I lost for whatever reason when employing various applications. Today, working in Scrivener, I accidentally cut a piece from a chapter I was working on and decided to look up a recent copy in TM, something I have never done before. But when I opened it in TM only the chapters and their synopses were available. I went back to a TM copy I made yesterday but that was the same.
Do I need to do something special in order to have TM back up my Scrivener work so that it can be restored in its entirety? And are full copies of work I’ve been saving for the last couple of months buried somewhere in TM?
I use a new iMac and the latest version of Mac OSX.
Thanks.
A consistent problem I’ve heard of with Time Machine is it backs up Scrivener files while their open, missing pieces (if I’ve understood the discussions correctly). To use Time Machine with Scrivener, you have to make sure Scrivener’s closed when you make the backup. The best way to back up work is to use the “Backup project to…” ZIP file option in the file menu.
So “undo” didn’t work? And if you deleted a complete file, have you checked the trash folder?
I recommend reading this thread.
https://forum.literatureandlatte.com/t/lost-work/6195/1
I also recommend that you only back up using TM when
(1) ALL package-based programs (like Scrivener) have been quit (i.e. really closed)
(2) you are backing up using the .zip method as Carradee has described above
(3) directly via cable and without using an airport to access the back-up drive.
In that thread, Jaysen explains one reason why TM might be failing and lists best practices. Amber also reminds people of airport’s cross-over bugs that might be complicating things. I describe some of the serious corruption issues I have found while testing Time Machine. TM is the only mac OS software that I have ever used that actually CANNOT do what it says is can do. It actually FAILS. I know you don’t want to hear that but at least you will now know what to do to avoid getting dinged in the future.
Apollo16
Apollo,
Might it be that our needs exceed the TM design? I think TM does it’s job pretty well for “basic users”, those who bought a mac because they liked the iPod. Think email, itunes, safari, and pages users. Those of us who actually use our systems with a real understanding of what they are capable of doing, are more likely to do things outside the “design spec” for software built for “basic users”. I would suggest that Scrivener pushes the envelope (in a good way) of how Apple expected packages to be used by applications. This is not bad, just unexpected.
I would also suggest that AmberV’s experience with TM is further proof that TM does work if you step back and fit it into your work flow in such a way that you are a “basic user” from TM’s perspective (I would suggest that my experience furthers this, but AmberV is a neutral third party here). I don’t think any of us would consider her use as “basic” yet she has successful backups and restores via TM. She has shown that she works around the TM limits in her workflow (as do I).
That said, I do agree with you that TM is not a perfect solution for backup. I do think it is adequate to most tasks and given its expected users we should be a little more forgiving of its shortcomings.
Just my 2¢
I don’t want to hijack this thread with rants about TM but I use four different package-based programs daily. So… TM does not live up to the advertising on many more things than just Scrivener. (I don’t argue that Scrivener is cutting edge but package-based is common now.) Also, I have noted that the advertising for TM has changed over the past year. Now Apple says not to use it over an airport. However, I have been using macs since 1987 and will never go back. You will have to pry my mac from my cold dead fingers. You can use TM with the caveats you outlined just fine. But you do need to know about those caveats. Note also that this problem extends to ALL back-up software that uses the methods you describe in your other post so I am not picking on Apple but on the basic design of this back up technique.
Sorry to sound strident. I should have used emoticons!
Apollo16
I’m with you 100%. I think the difference in our positions (if there is one) is that TM and other solutions, work fine for “basic users” and I don’t think anyone looking at Scriv is really a “basic user”. Apple’s view of what folks do with systems is a little myopic in my opinion.
I would note that Apple’s own software uses zips, not real packages. To me this is a pretty interesting fact.
Thanks very much for the helpful replies. Some follow-up questions:
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I’ve started saving zip backups to Dropbox and to a thumb drive. But when I open these backups, the chapters are not in order and are given confusing file names, making reviewing past work a cumbersome process. Is this something I have to live with in using a zip backup?
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Is there a way to save the project externally (eg to a thumb drive) so that it opens up exactly as it does when I open up Scrivener and start work everyday on my Mac?
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I found the latest copy of my project in its entirety in Documents. Given I could only see this one copy and not previous saves, I take it that Scrivener at the end of the work day simply saves over previous copies made while retaining the same name?
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Regarding No. 3, I’ve given this copy its own name. I assume that by doing this, when I end my workday today and save, Scrivener will make a separate copy to the one I’ve renamed?
Again, thanks for your help.
K
It sounds like you are trying to open the Scrivener project in something other than Scrivener? Yes, if you do that, it will just be a bunch of data files in an order that is only meaningful to the program. This sort of access to the raw data is handy in an emergency, but it is really not intended to be an alternative way of editing your project. In fact, doing that can cause damage to your projects. You should only ever edit the contents of the project with Scrivener.
I save files “externally” to a variety of places all of the time, and when I move them back to my Mac and open them they are ordinary Scrivener files. Again, it sounds like you not using Scrivener to open the files or something.
If what you mean by back-up is not a “technical backup” but rather an “author backup” then use the Export feature instead. Select the entire Binder and then use Export to create a mirror directory of all your Draft files and research, named just the way it is in Scrivener. Note it is good to keep “technical backups” too, though. If for some reason you lose the Scrivener project, or whatever, having zipped data backups like this will save you a lot of time.
You might be making all of this a little more complicated than it needs to be. As with most things on the computer, a file resides on the hard-drive. When you double-click on it, the file is loaded in the application that is designed to use it, when you save (or when it saves for you) the file is updated in-place.
Scrivener would waste tons of space and cause your drive to constantly be thrashing and using up its lifespan if it created new copies every time it saved! By default it saves “everything” whenever you pause from typing for two seconds.
Again, I think you are making this more complicated then it needs to be. It’s perfectly fine to just work in your project file and let it keep itself up to date (that is how Scrivener is designed to work most efficiently). By all means, create back-ups in a separate location as you have been, but spamming your Documents folders with lots of duplicates is going to make things very confusing down the road, when you forget which one is the “latest”.
Amber–Thanks for putting me straight. I was thinking of going the multicopy route because of the problem I described in working with the zip files. But how do I open the zip folder in Scrivener? I just tried now with my Dropbox and thumb drive saved copies, but they are greyed out when I try to open them with Scrivener.
K
The compressed zip format is used for two reasons: To save space and transfer time, and to protect the contents from over-zealous routines on external servers. To revert to a zip archived project, drag the zip file back to your Documents folder (hold down the option key to copy), or some other place more temporary (Downloads is handy for that) and double-click on it in Finder. This will un-archive the project. You can discard the zip file itself if you wish and double-click on the Scrivener project file. All should be as you left it when that particular back-up was saved.
Great! It works fine. Now I can write in peace.
Many thanks,
K