Hello!!! The list of ‘abandoned’ MS programs is long and painful. Try a search on Microsoft abandoned programs. The Wikipedia list though long misses quite a few.
Abandoned and discontinued is not the same !
Microsoft discontinues software years after a new stable version is relased. Scrivener 1.9x is abandoned while in active sale as the stable release ! Wake up people !
Who of you seriously think that Microsoft would have become world dominant - if they ever abandoned a product ?
Literature and Latte complains they cant afford to pay for developers. In reality they think they need money to pay attention… not realizing that it is actually free.
Dude, MS abandoned MS Money. There was no later stable version. They simply decided they were done with the product, and kicked their customers to the curb.
I eagerly await your spin on that. :mrgreen:
Best,
Jim
I literally just chucked my Zune HD into the garbage today, found it while cleaning out some drawers. Can’t even donate the Windows Phones anywhere. Ask developers how many frameworks Microsoft has just up and abandoned.
Here is my spin… read to understand - not just to reply. This is what I said:
I was talking about how Microsoft became world dominant (a limited time period) - a time period long before Ms Money . You and others are referring to a period after they became world dominant and started to do what ever they feel like… a period decades after Bill Gates built the monster. If Literature and Latte was world dominant, they could probable afford to do what they are doing also, but they are not. My guess is that they have survived because many are now using mac, and they have treated mac users better.
Put it back in context. It is part of a conversation about Literature and Lattes strategy for not having enough money to pay for maintenance of their current windows version. If Microsoft ever did what Literature and Latte is doing, they would never have become a success.
Besides, Microsoft discontinued - by announcing that they would no longer make new releases. They did not abandon it for years, leaving their users hanging … while focusing on other versions or products. Scrivener Mac users are on version 3, while Scrivener windows users have been stuck on version 1 for years, receiving only hollow promises that never materialized…
This is a gross mischaracterization. While it is true that we do not expect to maintain Win Scrivener 1 for as long as, say, Windows 7 has been maintained, neither I nor anyone else has ever said that we are unable or unwilling to support the current release version.
The Windows Scrivener 3 beta is hardly a “hollow promise.” It is very real and can be downloaded here:
Katherine
Mac users have lots of features, that does not exist in the Windows version. You call it mischaracterization, but the Mac version have also been prioritized for bugs over the windows version.
Windows users have been promised “that it is comming”… it is comming… for years.
So, lets say we move on to version 3 for windows. Why would it be any different now? My guess is that although Literature and Latte now finally has a new windows version, they still have the same culture of not prioritizing the windows version, and that by the time the mac version is on version 5 or 6, we would still be stuck in version 3 for windows… just like it has been for years…
I can not claim that it will be like that, it is just my guess. But if you read all replies on this topic, it usually comes down to how they don’t have money to support a large team of developers. It is a small company that have bitten over more than they can chew … etc.
Why would it be any different now, with even more code to maintain ?
Having a small focussed development team is not a sign of a company that doesn’t have money to throw around… nor any indication of success. I could give you any number of MS, Adobe etc applications that despite obscene amounts of money have been bug-ridden abominations on release, and in some cases never progressed far beyond infestation.
The Mac version is ahead because the owner of the company developed it on his own before there was any Windows version. The Windows team are developing V3 from the ground up, so obviously they have limited time to do tweaks on 1.9 and I’m certain the vast majority of users would not wish them to take focus from V3 to update a program that will go into support but no active development on release of V3.
It’s clear the no matter what anyone, multiple users or the L&L staff have to say, your mind is made up and will not be persuaded otherwise by all the facts in the world, so I’ll leave it at that and wish you well.
With how you keep mischaracterizing what L&L is saying, backtracking on what you claim you meant to say when called out on it, and generally insisting on the most negative reading of everything available…
…why are you here?
Seriously not an attack. If you honestly believe the company is this incompetent or malicious, no matter how promising the software why are you here instead of just quietly writing them off?
Persuaded ? I asked a question !
You all rush in to debates about my comparison to Microsoft and most probable don’t even try to understand the points I am making - form the sound of it all.
Now two of you attack me ? What a joke.
Why on earth Adobe now is in the mix is beyond me. It is not comparable in any way what so ever. Scrivener is a very simple software, and should be bug free in short amount of time, if even just one person worked on it continuously.
No - don’t debate that with me. I have been developing software for almost 30 years, so do not go there. Scrivener 1.9x for windows is a very simple code.
The official support team, lucky for me, were a little more professional (a lot less defensive), and I hereby include the official reply that I received today.
Clearly the future way for me to discuss something, because this forum is just a waste of time on this type of issue.
[i]Hi Aron,
I’ll need that old gmail address to search our records for you.
Major versions of Scrivener for Mac typically last quite a few years, with maintenance releases along the way as needed. We are a small company with limited resources and don’t add features for the sake of it, so don’t release major updates every year.
Version 1 for Windows has only lasted as long as it has because we’ve had to do a near complete re-write to update core technologies and have chosen to make it equivalent to the more mature Mac version (which came first), so it will be much larger version jump.
I think sales are split nearly 50/50 between Mac and Windows so we aren’t going to neglect the Windows version.
Regards,
Rob[/i]
As you can read above the sales of Scrivener indicates that the Windows version will not be neglected anymore. That is what is call an answer to the question.
What is your problem ? NO, forget I asked, I don’t want to know. Just do not insinuate words in to my mouth ever again. It is really not acceptable. I NEVER SAID THE COMPANY IS INCOMPETENT and I never said is it MALICIOUS… you really should watch what you type …
it is also manipulative to accuse me of: “backtracking on what you claim” It is dishonest, because the reality is that you did not understand the first explanation i made, and instead of accepting that, you accuse me of changing it… You said you are seriously not attacking me? what a joke.
And NO, I do not mischaracterizing L&L, my data is from the company’s staff directly. Quoted from facts give to me in writing. So again, watch what you type.
And that’s the answer you had already been given by users and L&L staff on this thread. Instead of getting all shitty (even threatening to Devinganger?) you could have taken that instead of ridiculous comparisons to MS.
My mention of Adobe was pointing out that like MS, obscene budgets and large staff do not guarantee good output or commitment and made your MS comments invalid.
As for telling us not to debate you because of your 30 years developing software, I am aware of several in this forum (including myself) with greater experience so dropping that into the conversation is just inviting a pi…ing contest. Achieves nothing except giving us a good belly laugh.
If you think Scrivener is a simple piece of software (Hint, it’s not) it should be a doddle for you to use your vast software experience and go write your own version.
Meanwhile the rest of us will just appreciate the hard work and creative effort by the L&L developers.
“A stupid man’s report of what a clever man says can never be accurate, because he unconsciously translates what he hears into something he can understand.”
― Bertrand Russell, A History of Western Philosophy
Ah, finally some self awareness from the OP. 
I would comment, but I’m laughing so hard I can’t breathe.
Katherine
I have been a C++ programmer for more than 20 years. I have used Qt from one of the first releases. You might know that this is the technology on witch Scrivener is developed. I have been running software companies since 1993, and know this business from all sides. I have worked for both Microsoft and for Adobe… no wonder you are laughing. I must be clueless.
“The things about smart people is they sound crazy to dumb people.”
Steve Jobs
Since you got mad when I disputed you last time, I will simply agree this time.
Maybe so, but you never learned to discuss with humans in a civilized, adult way.
If you ask questions in a user forum, you can’t expect to dictate the answers. You have to accept the answers you get, even if you don’t like them. If you know the answers to your questions, why ask them in the first place?
You come across as a spoiled child, or possibly a bitter old man who never succeeded and became what you hoped to become. Not as a professional with in-depth knowledge about software development. But then again, time doesn’t always transform into knowledge and wisdom.
What is it really you want to achieve with your posts?
This forum i known for a specific tone.
I have underlined this tone (how you describe me) in your’e last post - se above.
I have personally been here a few times over the years, and have the same experience every time I am here. So how I come across to you, is not so much based on me, but my feeling and experience both now and from the past - triggered by how you and others here answer questions.
This last post from you alone - is actually enough - to show it. You talk about me, and the other people here talk about me. And you use words to describe me in just about every post, that are negative.
Maybe I have talked in a way you consider negative about some software, but most of the replies to my posts have been met by negativity towards ME - A PERSON. So you should all get a big mirror… and look in to it until you see what I just wrote.
I have no interest in talking about myself. I did not come here to talk about me but the freaking software. This is not a self-awareness forum. Profesjonalism, is to at least get in to the head what the topic is…
You are the once that drag down scrivener… by filling this forum with negative talk towards any person coming here that you don’t like… I have directed criticism towards actual reality about scrivener and L&L that they do not deny. They are aware of it, and apologize for the reality of it. You get offended when this reality is pointed out, and attack me for pointing it out and discussing it. That is the core of how restarted any conversation gets with you. ( I did not say YOU are retarded, although very tempting)
You have not learned anything from conversations like this in the past. First time this was pointed out by myself years ago, and the tone here is exactly the same now… years later. ¨
Why I’m here? Because I know the limited resources, so I try not to bother the people at official support with things i could figure out in the forums. But to be completely direct with you… It is to negative to get insight from people that drag you down for talking about anything they consider negative… most support is centered around negative experiences - so you and your sidekick should do L&L a favor and leave this forum.
In the same sentence - you manage to tell me I have to accept your answers… and that I am trying to dictate you. I repeat, you kick yourself in the ass - even within the same sentence.
If you are going to try to force someone to accept what you say, at least do not attack them for doing the same - in the same sentence. I have given two quotes from famous people… go read them again.
I did not get mad because you did not agree. I am bothered by the fact that you 1) attack me as a person, 2) reply with deliberate intentions to disrupt.
Your tone and constant descriptions of me, and how you feel about me, is what is insulting and bothers me. You act as if you have the right to be negative towards me, because I am negative towards my experiences with scrivener. You have issues ! Seriously!